Words
Elgar Johnson
Published
Reading Time
9 Min Read
CircleZeroEight contributing editor Ryan Pickard talks to us about his directorial debut.
Boxing is a sport that has impacted many. But Repton is a special place, the Mecca of growth and reputation in British boxing led by the Inimitable coach Tony Burns.
Ryan Pickard takes us on a journey on the history of Repton and some of their greatest stories along the way.
Elgar: Tell us about the film, what is it about?
Ryan: 'Learning The Ropes' is about life. Boxing is the vehicle but I believe whatever you're facing in life you'll be able to relate to what you see on screen. We follow characters from old legends like the great Tony Burns right down to the nursery that start boxing as young as five years old. Sometimes you can take as much from what the innocent kids say as you can from the wise old coach or champion. Tony Burns was a great man that impacted so many with his dedication and coaching. He was the epitome of east end masculinity and in a way the film shows what love is to him. That's my romantic perception anyway. The film is a homage to my old coach Tony Burns, who we all miss very much.
I say boxing when done properly is the vehicle to get to know yourself, the you that is in the ring expressed in physical form correlates with your behaviour and traits outside of the ropes, and you can learn a lot from that.
— Ryan Pickard
Elgar: How did this project come around?
Ryan: Tony Burns my coach developed dementia and was starting to show signs that he just wasn't well enough anymore. It was heartbreaking, to see a man so respected and strong start to show this vulnerability. This man, respected by all, world champions, royalty, the underworld and such a name synonymous with Repton & East London. A man amongst men. I really wanted to capture his essence to help it live on beyond the timeframe that he'd physically be with us. I also started to ponder what it was about the club itself that was so special, and wanted to capture that before it would inevitably change without its father figure present.
Elgar: This was a project built out of very little budget, how do you navigate this?
Ryan: Passion. Honestly, I had an idea and was relentless with my passion towards it. Nobody got paid for their work on this film, I wanted to make something with the same ethos as the Repton boxing club and see what would come of it. Everyone volunteers at Repton, I thought this may be the alchemy that was needed - everyone believing in something bigger than themselves. Proceeds go back to the cause not in pockets. I remember watching 'Hunger' by Steve McQueen at the screen on the Green Islington, a brilliant film, and listened to a Q&A with McQueen after and he explained how he'd searched for a wildlife photographer to capture some of his vision because he believed that the skill needed for wildlife would be what's needed. I took this and thought about it. I believed that a fashion photographer would have the eye and sensitivity needed to capture what my vision was and so I approached Morgan White, also knowing he had an interest in boxing and told him about my mad idea, he was onboard. I bombarded him with references and thoughts and before long Learning The Ropes (not yet named that) had a cinematographer. So before long after putting my energy out there to the universe that this would happen I started to meet people that had the skill sets to bring this to life. Miguel Lloro the lovely editor that worked with me out of hours tirelessly, another one that bought my madcap idea. Matt D'urban Jackson's details given to me and gave me a yes to meet for a chat about recording sound, ended up being my camera operator who then brought his mate in with his steadi-cam Nathan Claridge. I love a bit of steadi-cam. Then I met by chance Thomas Pink who was sound recording on the side of being a brilliant musician, he ended up composing the score for me and worked with violinist Dorry Macauley. What seemed like luck, I put down to emitting a relentless energy that says this will happen. We create our own luck. All of these talented people willing to get involved with a project they knew little about apart from my passionate ramblings. Thanks to them it came to life. I must tip my hat to soho queen Liz Pearson as well, a real character that for whatever reason had my back on this project and helped me with editor Miguel, colourist Billy Mahoney and some belief.
The schooling I had, as in my state school education, taught me very little, in fact I'd say it hindered me, tried to tell me I 'couldn't' and failed to recognise my talents and capabilities. Repton nurtured, believed in me, and celebrated me, like a family should.
— Ryan Pickard
Elgar: You have some great characters in the film including Ray Winstone, how did this come about?
Ryan: Ray Winstone is a fellow Reptonite, he boxed for the club and I'd met Ray on numerous occasions. To ask Ray to do this for free, I was pushing myself out there a bit with that one, some would say taking the piss. However my dad would always say, if you don't ask you don't get. I thought about lots of other possibilities but my vision always came back to Ray, so I eventually text him. Of course, he's a proper person, doesn't forget what helped mould him and give him the ingredients to push his own ceiling up. He said yes pretty much immediately, I'd have to work it into a gap in his schedule, I'd have a couple of hours with him, no ifs buts or maybes, nail it in one, and we did it. Thank you Ray for your willingness, and again I go back to passion being the currency. My intentions were pure and I think people feel that. He still said yes though which I was very grateful for.
Elgar: How has boxing inspired you and how does it continue to?
Ryan: Where do I start. Originally, boxing allowed me to express myself freely, I was given the green light to let it all out, that was a liberation. As I've grown to love the sport I see that it works in many ways, it truly is an art when done properly (passionately), I say boxing when done properly is the vehicle to get to know yourself, the you that is in the ring expressed in physical form correlates with your behaviour and traits outside of the ropes, and you can learn a lot from that. First though you need the courage to step up.
What seemed like luck, I put down to emitting a relentless energy that says this will happen. We create our own luck.
— Ryan Pickard
Elgar: Tell us about your relationship with Repton?
Ryan: Repton was my school. The schooling I had, as in my state school education, taught me very little, in fact I'd say it hindered me, tried to tell me I 'couldn't' and failed to recognise my talents and capabilities. Repton nurtured, believed in me, and celebrated me, like a family should. You know in a loving household you walk in and see a few pictures dotted around, celebrating the ones they love, Repton does that. It did it for me.
Elgar: You discuss many different subjects throughout the film from racial equality and difficult stereotypes, how has this changed and evolved?
Ryan: Something I learned looking back and creating this film is that somebody's intentions and actions are what create the bubble around them. Language is only 5% of how we communicate, the rest is tone of voice, body language and expression. I feel today in some way we have lost the ability to use humour across cultures, races, religions, sexuality, gender and this provides a barrier for connection. These old boys to me, Tony Burns being one of them, were surrounded by a bubble built on respect and love. Class, colour and culture didn't come into it. If you could prove you wanted to grow, learn, transform yourself and had a solid character you were welcome. Sometimes you had to get through the harsh humour to become worthy of the inner circle, but once you did that circle was love. Boxing was the vehicle, but I think this place was more than that. I don't think the film discusses this as you put it, I think it shows honesty and love through the areas you mentioned, despite of constraints we are made to believe are there, which I think takes somebody with a desire to grow and evolve to even understand and see. If we want to be offended, or blame others for the way we feel, there's always plenty of opportunity, we can spend every day in conflict. I think we need to look closely, dig a bit deeper. How can we take control of our bubble and drop a narrative that doesn't serve us. Look around the Repton, the proof is there, anyone is welcome, as long as you want to expand. Like Tony says in the film "I'm only interested in people that want to learn from things and get on in life, I want them to prove things and give them some encouragement." That says it all really.
Elgar: Boxing is seen by many as TV entertainment much in the same world as WWE and UFC, do you agree with this?
Ryan: It can be entertaining for one and a masterpiece for another. I don't like to go to the arenas for the big fights, most of the people there are seeking entertainment. I like to watch with a cup of tea in my living room, appreciating the artistry. I think WWE, UFC, are art forms just as well, they just aren't a discipline I know much about so can't appreciate it as deeply.
Elgar: What is the future of boxing?
Ryan: The future of boxing, some will hit, some will get hit.
Elgar: Who is the greatest of all time?
Ryan: This is a question I split in two. Technical. Spiritual. There are a number of fighters I'd list as technical greats, even active today, the likes of Bivol, Usyk, Crawford, they are true greats. With historical boxers like Sugar Ray Robinson, Roberto Duran, a young Mike Tyson, all having technical wizardry, but styles make fights so it's so hard to pick a number one. Spiritually, there's only one man with this character and charisma, Muhammad Ali. He transcended the sport. I do love Usyk, he seems a real solid character with a lot of charisma & personality, maybe we will see how his impact on the world can transcend the sport in time. What a fight that would have been, Ali v Usyk. I've mentioned Usyk in both my categories here, does that mean he's my number one? I'm reluctant to commit.
Learning The Ropes premieres tonight at the BFI
